Ambassador Boaz Modai

8/7/2019 Ambassador Boaz Modai

1/850| | WINTER 10|

| The Middle East |

Welcome to Ireland Mr. Ambassador. Could you give a brief

overview of Israels current diplomatic relations with Ireland and

what has your own introduction to this country been like?

Between our two peoples, there is a lot more in common than

might first appear. We are two small peoples with long histories,

both having suffered much and come through bad times. In cultural

life, we both give a high status to the written and spoken word and

therefore invest much creative energy in literature and the theatre.

We have both recently come through a similar transition from a

largely agricultural to a hi-tech based economy. And in both of our

societies, there is a high level of popular interest in politics much

more than you will find, say, in the US or the UK.

Our relationship at the trade and economic level is mutually

beneficial. Trade between us amounts to $400 million per year,

three-quarters of it Irish exports to Israel. As far as relations

between our governments are concerned, it is true that we have

not always seen eye to eye. However, it is our experience that when

governments of other countries come to understand the realities

and the complexities of our situation, relations tend to improve. Theimportant thing here is to maintain an ongoing dialogue between

governments. I am very pleased to note that last May, the first ever

high-level meeting between officials of the Irish and Israeli Foreign

Ministries took place in Jerusalem. This is a positive development,

and something we plan to repeat annually, once in each capital.

I arrived here only in mid-August, and my reception has been

friendly and warm. The people I have met have been open and

hospitable and have made my family and

myself feel comfortable and at home. The

conversations I have had so far have been

open and frank and conducted in a good

atmosphere. I have already seen somethingof the beauty of Ireland. Just last month

we toured the west coast from the Kerry

peninsulas up to the Cliffs of Moher and

found the scenery breathtaking. I am looking

forward to seeing more of the country.

I would like at this point to acknowledge

the importance of Irelands Jewish

community. The community, though small,

has supplied the Dil with TDs in each of

its three main political parties. And it has

given Israel one of i ts most famous families.

Chaim Herzog, son of a Chief Rabbi of

Ireland, was born in Belfast and educated in

Dublin before he moved to Israel, fought in

its War of Independence and finally became

Israels sixth President. His son Isaac

Herzog is today a Cabinet Minister in Israels

Government.

What are the key concerns for Israel in

terms of regional security? Has there

been any notable progress in relations with

Damascus, Cairo, Amman and Beirut?

Firstly, as you are probably aware, Egypt

and Jordan have both concluded peace

treaties with Israel. Our dialogue with Cairo

and Amman is open and frank, we co-

The Israeli Ambassador to Ireland, His Excellency Mr Boaz Modai,speaks to SIGNAL about relations with Ireland, Israels challengesin the Middle East and what the future holds for his country.

The dplomatc Vew: israel

Above: Tel Aviv


2/8|WINTER 10| | 51

operate at many levels and Israel seeks to

expand this co-operation.

Israels principal security concern in the

region is, of course, Iran. With its race tobuild a nuclear weapon and its leadership

frequently calling for the elimination of

Israel, it is an existential threat for us. But

Irans long arm that penetrates the region

makes it a threat not just to Israel but to the

Arab states. Its two proxies, Hezbollah in

Lebanon and Hamas in Gaza, both of them

armed and trained by Iran, form a part of its

strategy of hostile encirclement of Israel,

but also deepen the influence of Iran in

the wider region and threaten the stability

of Lebanon and other Arab countries.

Israel has been warning the international

community for years of the danger posed

by Irans nuclear uranium enrichment

program. In fact, Irans nuclear ambitions

have become a problem for the entire democratic and peace-seeking

world. The fact that sanctions are now finally beginning to take

effect is a demonstration that Israels warnings have been in some

measure successful.As for Damascus, Israel has called on the Syrians to enter

dialogue and make peace for the sake of the welfare of both Israelis

and Syrians. Unfortunately, Syria has remained a close ally of Iran

and works with that country to boost the strength of Hezbollah on

our northern border. The Syrians have set preconditions for talks by

demanding a full withdrawal from the Golan Heights. Israel wants

negotiations without preconditions in which the Golan should be one

of the matters for negotiation.

After Israel made its peace treaty with Egypt, it expected that

Lebanon would be the second country to make peace with Israel.

However, the strong Syrian influence in Lebanon has left it in a tragic

position a hostage in the hands of Hezbollah, a radical Islamic

group controlled, financed and trained by Iran. We can only hope that

the positive political groups there will succeed in moving it closer to

the moderate parts of the Arab world.

| The Middle East |

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu meets Palestinian Premier, Mahmoud Abbas, at the start of the now stalled peace talks

which were launched by President Barack Obama in September.


3/852| | WINTER 10|

President Ahmadinejad recently received a heros welcome in

Lebanon. How concerned is Israel about this and how does it view

the visit generally?

President Ahmadinejads visit to Lebanon recently was a

disturbing development. For one thing, it was clearly a provocation.Ahmadinejad and his regime have repeatedly called for the

annihilation of Israel, and, as the whole world knows and is

concerned about, Iran is trying to acquire nuclear capability.

Ahmadinejad arrives in Lebanon and goes within five kilometres of

the border!

His visit was a blatant act of triumphalism. Iran, through its

proxy, Hezbollah, is dangerously close to achieving its objective of

the past thirty years exporting the Shia

revolution by creating another Shia state

likewise dedicated to terrorism and spreading

instability. Hezbollah is now a major political

force in Lebanon, and has an arsenal of

more than 40,000 rockets (making it far

more powerful than most of the worlds

armies); in short, it is a state within a state.

Ahmadinejads visit will only embolden

Hezbollah to go further, and try and take over

Lebanon altogether. This prospect worries us

deeply, but it also scares the Arab powers. It

is tragic for the Lebanese people too, most

of whom do not support Hezbollah and would

resent their country being a puppet of Iran.

In relation to Lebanon, does Israel

recognise the blue line as the border

between Lebanon and Israel?

Yes. In 2000, Israel unilaterally withdrew

all its troops beyond the blue line and this

withdrawal was recognised by the United

Nations as a complete withdrawal from

Lebanon.

Accepting that the UN has concluded that

the Israeli withdrawal from South Lebanon

is complete, what is the official Israeli

position on the area known as the Sheebaa

Farms?In his report dated 22 May 2000, United

Nations Secretary General, Kofi Annan,

affirmed that Israel had fully withdrawn its

forces from Lebanon in accordance with

UN Security Council Resolution 425. The

Sheebaa farms area is not disputed territory,

but is considered by the United Nations as

Syrian territory. In the 2000 report, it is

stated that the United Nations had examined ten maps issued after

1966 by Lebanese government institutions and six maps issued

by the Syrian Government, including three after 1966, and that all

of them place the Sheebaa farms within the borders of the Syrian

Arab Republic. In a fur ther statement on 10 April, 2002, Secretary

General Annan said: Attacks at any point along the Blue Line,

including in the Sheebaa Farms area in the occupied Golan Heights,

are violations of Security Council Resolutions Israel accepts

these determinations of the United Nations.

The status of this territory can ultimately

be finalised in direct peace negotiations

between Israel and Syria.

What are your thoughts on Hezbollah

activity at present? Do you believe there is

an active process of rearming in progress

as has been suggested recently and could

Israel do more to help limit the influence

of Hezbollah and Damascus on the

Government of Lebanon?

I dont need to believe that Hezbollah is

rearming I know it! Since the end of the

second Lebanon war in 2006, Hezbollah

has restocked its armoury with tens of

thousands of new rockets and other

weaponry supplied by Iran. Engineers and

technicians in Iranian uniform have been

seen on the Lebanese border engaged

in training and the installation of new

armaments, so that Hezbollah is essentially

an outpost of the Iranian army on Israels

northern border. The new rockets are more

sophisticated and have a range that can

reach much further into Israel than those

of the last war. It is clear that Hezbollah is

busily preparing for the next round of war.

Under UN Security Council Resolution 1701,

it was the duty of the UN and the LebaneseArmy to ensure the disarmament of

Hezbollah. This has not happened; instead,

Hezbollah has ignored the UN, overawed

the legitimate armed forces of Lebanon

and proceeded to rearm and strengthen i ts

forces. It now holds hostage the population

of southern Lebanon. It is a situation fraught

with danger, both for Israel and for the

people of Lebanon. Israel would obviously

prefer to see Lebanon as a strong, stable

democratic country, free from Hezbollah

subversion and independent of Syrian andIranian machinations. However, this is an

internal Lebanese problem and it is for the

Lebanese themselves to solve.

How would you interpret the effectiveness

of UNIFIL as it currently stands? Has Israel

co-operated fully with demining and related

activity following its withdrawal from

Lebanon?

Yes, Israel has co-operated fully in these

activities. We do not wish to be the judges

of UNIFILs effectiveness, but we have our

doubts. Indeed it was reports from the UN

itself that have admitted that weapons are

continuing to pour into Lebanon.

| The Middle East |

It is two states for twopeoples, the existing state of

Israel as the nation-state of

the Jewish people living side

by side in peace and security

with the future Palestinian

state as the nation-state of

the Palestinian people. The

situation brought about

by Hamas rule in Gaza

is a major obstacle to the

realization of this vision.

The population of Gaza

is hostage in the hands of

Hamas.


4/8|WINTER 10| | 53

How would you analyse the results of

recent/current talks with the Palestinian

Authority? Do you believe that there has

been progress on a performance-based

Road Map to a two-state solution? What

has the erection of the security barrier

meant for the average Israeli citizen?

It is important to have dialogue. Without

it, no progress can be made. The stimulus

to the current revival of peace negotiationswas the speech of Prime Minister Netanyahu

at Bar-Ilan University in June 2009, when

he called for negotiations to achieve an

independent, viable Palestinian state living

side by side in peace and security with

Israel, in line with the expectations set out

in the Road Map. These talks represent

the best hope in a long time for a peaceful

resolution of the conflict. Given the failure

of previous attempts at Camp David and

Annapolis, it is understandable that there

should be scepticism among the majority

of Israeli citizens about the chances of

success this time. Nevertheless, I firmly

believe that the Israeli public is ready to

make the necessary painful concessions if

they are convinced that the Palestinian leadership is genuinely ready

to make peace with Israel. It is too soon to expect concrete results

from these negotiations. And although they began recently, they are

already at a very delicate stage.

The erection of the security barrier over the past decade reduced

dramatically the number of terrorist attacks emanating from the

West Bank and the numbers of Israeli victims of those attacks. The

death tolls from suicide bombings each year as the security barrier

was gradually put in place tell their own story: 220 in 2002, 142 in

2003, 55 in 2004 and so on down to 3 in 2007. May I remind thereaders that in the last decade alone Israel lost more than 1,000

civilians murdered, including 125 Israeli children, and over 5,000

were wounded, in brutal terror attacks. One must be fair and ask

what Israel could do to stop the terror. The barrier did just that it

has been saving lives!

This improvement in security has in turn allowed an easing of

controls: the numbers of roadblocks and checkpoints have been

drastically reduced in the West Bank, and the US-trained Palestinian

Authority security forces have done sterling work in cracking down

on Hamas terrorism in the West Bank. These changes have allowed

more normal conditions to resume and facilitated an economic

boom: last year the World Bank reported a 9% growth rate in the

West Bank economy. This shows Palestinians that the path of peace

and moderation is far better for themselves than the Hamas path of

rejectionism and tyranny.

| The Middle East |

An El-Al flight, Israels national airline, approaches Tel Avivs Ben Gurion airport.


5/854| | WINTER 10|

What is the Israeli vision of a solution to the West Bank issue

and the Hamas issue? Where can progress realistically be madeand where can Israel take the initiative in moving the situation

forward? What lessons have been learned on the Israeli side from

Operation Cast Lead?

My answer to the last question outlines Israels vision of the

solution. It is two states for two peoples, the existing state of

Israel as the nation-state of the Jewish people living side by side in

peace and security with the future Palestinian state as the nation-

state of the Palestinian people. The situation brought about by

Hamas rule in Gaza is a major obstacle to the realisation of this

vision. The population of Gaza is hostage in the hands of Hamas.

It came to power in 2006 in elections which its opponents, Fatah,

claim were conducted fraudulently. In 2007, Hamas eliminated its

Fatah rivals in Gaza in a violent coup, killing more than 700 Fatah

members. All this has been a tragedy for the Gazan people. In

2005, the complete withdrawal of Israeli troops and settlers gave an

opportunity for Gaza to become a blueprint for peaceful Palestinian

self-government and prosperity. Instead,

the Hamas regime, in line with i ts fanatical

religious ideology, though it could no longer

kill significant numbers of Israelis with

suicide bombings, escalated its rocket and

mortar attacks against southern Israel. In

the four years before Israel disengaged,

the rocket and mortar attacks had totalled2,386, or about 10 per week. In the year

after the disengagement, until Hamas

violent takeover in June 2007, they doubled

to 21.4 per week. In the year after that, until

the start of the ceasefire in June 2008,

they rose to an average of 63.6 attacks per

week and doubled again when Hamas ended

the ceasefire at the end of 2008, when

Israel finally had no option but to launch its

Operation Cast Lead to end them. These

facts indicate that Hamas is not interested

in achieving Palestinian self-government but

in giving effect to the mandate in its Charter

for the destruction of Israel.

The solution to the Hamas issue lies in

the hands of Hamas itself. Israel agrees with

| The Middle East |

Above: Damage from Hezbollah rockets on an apartment in

Haifa during the 2006 conflict.

Top right: Members of Hamas militant wing, dressed as suicide

bombers at a rally.

Bottom right: Heart of the matter: Old Jerusalem, a divided city

and one of the holiest areas for both Jews and Muslims.


6/8|WINTER 10| | 55

the conditions set down by the Quartet (UN, US, EU and Russia) for

Hamas to enter peace negotiations: (1) recognition of Israels right

to exist, (2) renunciation of violent methods, (3) consent to abide

by existing agreements reached between Israel and the Palestinian

Authority. If it accepts these conditions, Israel is ready to negotiate

with it.

As for lessons to be learned from Cast Lead, the Israel Defence

Forces always try to improve their techniques aimed at minimising

civilian casualties consistent with their military goals. Their internal

investigations since the end of the operation have been focused on

learning from mistakes made and putting new policies in place to

avoid them in future. One has to wonder, though, about the singling

out of Israel by the world media for criticism of its fight against

terror. Many western allies fight terror around the world, and their

| The Middle East |

right campaign against terror often tragically

results in unintentional harm to civilians, in

numbers much greater than those claimed

- and not substantiated by proof againstIsrael. This is a clear case of double

standards. Israelis are fighting for their lives,

and too many in the international community

are busy trying to tie Israels hands in a

way that makes it harder and harder for

Israel to defend itself. But lets remember:

the enemies of Israel are the enemies of

Western civilisation. If Israel were to fall, it

would not be the last to fall.

The Palestinians have reiterated that

any recommencement of settlement

construction is a walk away issue. What is

your Governments position domestically in

relation to this issue and would agreement

to an extension of the moratorium possibly

precipitate an election?

It is impossible to comment on whether

an extension of the moratorium would

bring about an election. At the moment, it

seems that this issue is being used by the

Palestinian side as an excuse to obstruct

the progress of the negotiations. It is

important to remember that this moratorium

was announced by Israel last November, 12months ago, as a once-off goodwill gesture

to encourage the Palestinian Authority to re-

enter talks. They delayed doing so until only

three weeks remained of the moratorium,

and immediately said that they would walk

away unless it was renewed. Now they

try to place the blame on Israel for the

possibility that the talks may collapse. The

moratorium applied to new building within

existing settlements crches, schools,

synagogues etc. Its expiry does not affect

the Governments policy of building no newsettlements in the West Bank.

The issue of settlements never prevented

peace negotiations from taking place in the

past. The Camp David-Taba talks of 2000-

01 and Palestinian President Abbas talks

with former Prime Minister Olmert in 2008

took place while settlement building went

on. Neither did settlements ever prevent

Israel from implementing a peace agreement

in the past. In the peace treaty with Egypt

concluded in 1979, Israels side of the

bargain was to withdraw from the huge Sinai

territory it had occupied in its 1967 war of

self-defence against Egypt. It did so, and

in the process removed all of the Israeli

settlements in the Sinai.


7/856| | WINTER 10|

You stated that the moratorium applied to

new building within existing settlements

crches, schools, synagogues etc It

has been widely reported that the Israeli

State now plan on constructing newhouses in East Jerusalem. How do you

reconcile this fact?

The city of Jerusalem, as Israels

eternal capital and the focus of the Jewish

peoples national aspirations for 2,000

years (more than 700 references to it

in the Bible), is in a separate category

from the West Bank and thus was never

included in the moratorium on building

within settlements. New building of

houses there for both its Jewish and Arab

residents continues subject to a long

approval process under the planning rules

of the municipality. It would be as illegal to

freeze the building of Jewish houses in the

eastern part of Jerusalem as it would be to

freeze the building of Arab houses in the

western part of the city.

A humanitarian relief flotilla was

intercepted on route to Gaza by the Israeli

State with tragic consequences. What are

you thoughts on this operation and do you

think that the IDF will learn from this and

change tactics next time?

The circumstances of the flotilla in June

this year were indeed tragic. No one wanted

nine people to die. However, the incident

was grossly misrepresented at the time.

Now, the facts are all out there for anyone

to see. Most of the boats and passengers

in the flotilla were well-meaning people,

even if their views of Gaza were misguided

and based on simplistic propaganda.

However, there was one ship which caused

all the trouble, the Mavi Marmara. It was

hijacked by about forty members of theAl-Qaeda-linked so-called Islamic charity

organisation, the IHH. They took over the

ship, armed themselves, and refused

to co-operate peacefully with the Israeli

Navy. They broadcast anti-semitic slogans

and prepared for combat and martyrdom.

To call those people peace activists is

absolutely ridiculous. Nine of them were

killed in the subsequent struggle. It was

unfortunate, but it was certainly no war

crime by the Israeli military. The Israeli

personnel who landed on the ship merely

defended themselves as best they could

under a ferocious onslaught, the savagery

of which is clearly evident in footage of the

incident.

| The Middle East |

Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu


8/8|WINTER 10| | 57

No one can deny that the outcome was unfortunate. But, the

truth is the Israeli Navy prepared for weeks before the incident; the

boats coming were given ample warning to halt and be boarded;

all complied, except the one ship as above which was hijacked byterrorist fundamentalists who wanted a struggle.

The IDF will continue to patrol the waters off Gaza to prevent the

illicit import of weapons and armaments into Hamas-controlled Gaza.

That is the unfortunate reality Hamas is at war with us, it controls

Gaza, so obviously we have to restrict certain goods and persons

from getting into Gaza by sea.

What are the major international relations concerns for the

Israeli political leadership? Do you believe that there has been

any noticeable change in attitude towards Mr. Netanyahus

administration from the US and the European Union?

Outside the Middle East, the Government gives great importance

to improving our relations with India and China. During his first year

in office, Foreign Minister Lieberman carried out extensive tours of

various countries such as Ethiopia, Kenya, Uganda and Tanzania in

Africa and Brazil, Argentina, Peru and Colombia in South America.

With these countries we have signed co -operation agreements in

areas such as the development of agriculture and water resources.

In addition, in the last year Israel has opened a new embassy in

Turkmenistan and consulates in Sao Paolo and St. Petersburg, and

re-opened its embassy in New Zealand. We plan to open shortly

another embassy on the African continent, in Accra, Ghana.

Our relations with the United States were and are of great

importance to us. The US is our most important ally. Its efforts in

the past and its renewed effor ts at present to promote the peaceprocess between Israel and the Palestinians are much appreciated

by the Government and people of Israel. The peace process also

needs the support of the European Union, as a major actor in the

international arena, and indeed the EU is actively involved through

the Quartet. It is imperative that only honest brokers that

is, elements that are equally friends to both the Israeli and the

Palestinian are involved in this process. Anyone who has no basic

sympathy with both the Palestinians and Israelis narratives cannot

really help the advancement of reconciliation of this conflict.

How do Israelis view international media reporting of the situation

in the region?One cannot view the international media as a monolith: they vary

much from place to place. However, in some countries, there is an

insufficient understanding of the complexities of the conflict and of

Israels position regarding its security needs. In the media outlets

of these countries, coverage of the conflict is either superficial

or heavily slanted towards one side. There is a tendency towards

sensationalism, reflected in lurid and misleading headlines,

manipulative editing and publishing of provocative photographs

that also mislead. Such coverage reinforces clichd and simplistic

concepts instead of explaining the deeper story. Sometimes, there

is a tendency among journalists to be indifferent to Israels security

concerns. You know, we are a country the same size as Leinster,

surrounded by 22 Arab states and Iran. Many of those neighbours

would like to see us disappear! It takes a real effort of imagination

for a journalist coming from a peaceful, unthreatened, neutral

country surrounded by water to appreciate our security concerns and

see the wider strategic picture in the region.

It is easier to look for victims the human

story and easier still to look for them on

one side only.

In the short to medium term (10-15 years),

how would Israel like to see the region

develop so it can be secure as a state and

benefit from economic opportunities with its

neighbours? How realistic is this?

As President Peres has often stated, we

visualise a future in which Israel exists side

by side in peaceful and mutually fruitful co-

operation with its Arab neighbours. One of

the misconceptions fostered by superficial

media coverage is the idea that Israels

welfare can only be won at the expense of

the Arabs, and vice-versa in other words,

that the Israel-Arab relationship is a zero-

sum game. But I am a believer in the win-win

vision outlined by the founder of Zionism,

Theodore Herzl, more than a century ago in

his book Altneuland, a vision that foresees

a future of development and prosperity for

both sides in the absence of conflict. How

realistic is this vision? They say that in

the Middle East, the realist is the one who

believes in miracles.

Many aspects of Israels history seemlike miracles. We lost 1% of our population

in the War of Independence against five

invading armies, a war in which the military

commander gave only a 50% chance of

Israels survival. Since then we have had to

fight five further wars for our existence, at the

same time managing to integrate immigrants

from 102 countries speaking 82 languages,

including a million immigrants from the

former Soviet Union and Ethiopia in the last

decade of the previous millennium alone.

We have developed a hi-tech economy thatproduces some of the worlds most advanced

products in the areas of communications,

medicine and the environment. Our start-up

companies are at the forefront of innovation,

bringing new scientific discoveries into the

arena of practical application. They are a

driving force of our economy. The US, with a

population of 320 million, is first in the world

for companies quoted on the NASDAQ. We,

with 7.3 million people, are second, not far

behind it with 121 companies!

If an end to the conflict can be achieved,

these developments can be shared with our

closest neighbours, improving the prosperity

and quality of life of all the inhabitants of the

region.

| The Middle East |

Documents

Ambassador Boaz Modai