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=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-APPLE II MUSIC & SOUND FORUM CONFERENCE LOGJuly 24, 1991 10 PM ETTopic: What's New in SoundSmith?Forum Leader: Joyce Madden (AFL JoyceM),Forum Assistant: Gene Koh (AFA Gene)Forum Consultants: Greg Dib (ELECTMUSIC), Ed Rosenblatt(AFC Eddie), Lindsay Hough (LindsayGS)

Copyright (c) 1991 America OnlineAll Rights Reserved=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

AFL JoyceM Okay...we can get started...and I have a fewcomments first... I would like to welcome Jim Maricondo ofDYA....better known to us as DYA Jim. If you haven'tchecked out our libraries recently, we have some very fine(excellent) files that DYA has uploaded to our libraryon instrument files for SoundSmith. And we hope in the nearfuture to have DYA as a link with AMS. Jim, would you liketo make some comments about DYA and their involvement in the

music field...then we can get to the questions and comments.Thanks.... Jim:

DYA Jim1 Yo Everyone! :) Currently, we have only one musicproduct actually released, and that is the DYA InstrumentDisk Volume 1 which is now in the library. We are workingon a couple other music projects for the future. We're notsure on details just yet, but there probably will be anotherinstrument disk (now that I've gotten some sound cards formy synthesizer .. finally! :) and I will be finishing HotLicks, our soundsmith player utility, sometime soon.

AFC Eddie Sounds great, Jim!!

DYA Jim1 That is basically it for now, but we might changethat or do more stuff in the future :)

AFL JoyceM Jim, want to explain a little more on what the SSplayer utility will do?

Mr Toaster Yes, please Jim.

DYA Jim1 The main extra features we are planning for it(i.e. NEW features we haven't seen implemented anywhere else.. yet) are several jukebox modes -shuffle, like a CDplayer, and modes where you can specifiy a combination of

files and folders to play in random or in sequence - andsome really neat "VU" effects.

Mr Toaster CoooooOOOOOOOOOoooooool!!!

AFL JoyceM VU effects?

DYA Jim1 We're experimenting with several new kinds of newVU graphical displays. (yah, you know, like how SoundSmithdoes it in graphic play mode). But we will be implementingseveral other variations, some of which we've come up with

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ourselves.

Mr Toaster (How can you have different kinds of VUmeters??!? I'm curious!!)

AFun Ian Like maybe analog ones?

DYA Jim1 (Wait and see! :) It'll be a good surprise. :)

All digital, currently, except for the LEDtrack/block/position display.

AFL JoyceM Have you all ever thought of making a SS editorto make inputing songs easier?

Mr Toaster Oooo, can't wait!!

AFL Marty I wondered the same thing Toaster... until I sawfor myself :)

Mr Toaster Good point.

AFA Gene Oooo analog ones! VERY cool idea, Ian! :)

DYA Jim1 We'll have to consider analog now though :) Ithadn't come up yet

Mr Toaster Like the little needle ones?

DYA Jim1 Let's see.. so far a SS editor isn't in ourlineup..Because of other commitments.

AFun Ian Joyce, SS/Zap is coming along... Poor Jim doesn'tneed to do an editor! :)

AFL JoyceM Jim, will this be PD, shareware or ?

AFA Gene Especially if you could get the needle-lines tobe "jaggy-less":)

DYA Jim1 Most likely shareware, but nothing is definiteyet :)

AFL JoyceM Great, Ian....was hoping you would speak up )

DYA Jim1 Good Ian :)

AFL JoyceM Jim, Ian do you all feel that the GS music

software is going to get better and more user friendly?

DYA Jim1 Hmm.. that's kinda difficult..

DYA Jim1 Unfortunately, synthLab/MidiSYNTH is on holdindefinitely, and there are tons of rumors that SoundSmithwill never be completed..

Mr Toaster It seems like it's on the edge of becomingawesome... except for AppleCo. :(

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DYA Jim1 However, I think instrument editing and songediting will get better.

AFL Marty I've heard those same rumors. Hope they'rewrong.

AFun Ian Well, I'm working on the easier to use side ANDthe better side. You'll see.

DYA Jim1 (You should see all the bugs in the MIDIsynthtoolset!) (there are TONS)

AFun Ian I don't like MIDIsynth. I think SoundSmith'llkill it! Esp. with my editor! :)

AFL Marty Bugs? In Apple software? You're kidding! :)

DYA Jim1 I'd like MIDIsynth IF it was a final buglessversion.

AFC Eddie Soundsmith won't kill it unless it has MIDI

implemented.

AFL JoyceM Agree, Eddie

Mr Toaster True.

AFC Eddie THEN it will kill it.

AFun Ian Eddie, THAT's what I mean! :)

AFC Eddie Oh!

AFL JoyceM Now that we have some excellent music programmers

on AOL, why don't you all get together and write the perfectmusic software :)

Mr Toaster Anyone know Huibert's number? What's longdistance to France cost, anyway? :)

AFC Eddie Do you know something we don't Ian?

AFL Marty I suspect that there is a way to input MIDI withSS...Huibert can't be entering all those songs via the"spreadsheet". I bet he has a private utility to do that.

DYA Jim1

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Mr Toaster (Eddie, I thought that was sLab! :)

DYA Jim1 You could disassemble Midisynth and go bughunting, but then you couldn't distribute your new version(yes, I know someone who did this :)

AFL JoyceM Eddie, want to elaborate on your songs more?

AFC Eddie True, Jim!

AFA Gene Actually.... the really BEST soundsmith songswill probably always be mostly spreadsheet even after MIDI"is" implemented (if it ever happens)... Cuz SS will alwaysquantize the MIDI input; i.e. it will not be like the way SLdoes it.

AFL Marty (Guess I scared Ian away :)

AFC Eddie I just UL'd two SLab songs using exclusivelySoundSmith instruments.

Mr Toaster AppleCo's lawyer brigade comes in.... yeah.

AFA Gene

AFC Eddie You're right, Gene.

DYA Jim1 (darn beatle record company)

AFC Eddie The Beatles are right!

AFA Gene Aren't they still selling the Apple MIDIInterface? Sam Ash still carries 'em.

Mr Toaster What Beatles? They broke up already!

DYA Jim1 I can't figure it out either, Gene.

AFC Eddie Anyway, if you really want to come as close asyou can to MIDI implementation with the sound of Soundsmith,you can do it with SynthCreate and AudioZap.

DYA Jim1 The only thing that Apple stopped in the way ofmusic, was synthlab. They still are updating their MIDImanager tools for the GS and Mac, they still sell the MIDIinterface, but they're not doing slab/msynth anymore.

AFL JoyceM Jim, how difficult would it be to write a utilityfor SS to allow MIDI input?

Mr Toaster Who seriously believes that Apple Records isgoing to sue AppleInc? Huh?

DYA Jim1 It's not a light undertaking..

AFC Eddie I do.

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Mr Toaster C'mon, they'd never win the case...it'd cost 'emtoo much money and it wouldn't be worth it in the end.

DYA Jim1 It entails a lot of doing..I wonder how Ian isgonna implement it..

AFL JoyceM A MIDI input utility would probably take SL outof the music market. BTW, Mark Cecys still gets on

AOL....leave him notes about upgrading the Tool35.

DYA Jim1 I heard at KFest that Mark Cecys quit the A2division.

AFA Gene IMO the hardest part would be to decide how tosplit all the MIDI keypresses into SS tracks... like someonecan hit 8 keys at once really easily.

AFL JoyceM I had heard that too about Mark...but he has beenworking on the Mac side soon after SL was released.

DYA Jim1 Yeah, I believe Mark switched to Mac :(

AFA Gene I'm not surprised, yet it's funny cuz mark wasoriginally from Ensoniq.

DYA Jim1 Yeah, I thought the same thing.. he dumped theEnsoniq. What people do to go work on the Mac side :(.The original main author of HCGS transferred over to the Macside and then got laid off.

AFA Gene Who knows, maybe we'll see an EPS 16+ in the nextMac. :)

AFL JoyceM What is so sad about this...is that Apple doesn't

care or take pride in what they release when it is buggy!

AFC Eddie That would be unbelievable, Gene!

DYA Jim1 Jim Mensch transferred over to the Mac side rightin the middle of writing the Animation Toolkit. So wonderthere's anyone left

AFA Gene Ed, there already exists such a card... the nameslips me at the moment, but that's basically what it is.

AFC Eddie For the Mac?

AFA Gene Yep. So who knows, Apple might just make itbuilt-in. ?

AFC Eddie Hmmmm, how about software support for it?

AFA Gene (Apple doesn't put out the card, btw. The peoplein MMS seem to love it.)

Mr Toaster Hee hee hee... some friends of mine and I built adigitizer for an IBM. We got everything soldered together,all the parts in the right places...Tested it out... It's a

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hunk o' junk.

AFL JoyceM Eddie, what to discuss how you did the SSinstruments into SL?

AFL JoyceM The IBM or your board, Toaster?

Mr Toaster I think the Radio Shack guy gave us the wrong

chips.

AFC Eddie Sure...

Mr Toaster Both! :) Naah, the board. (I know, excuses,excuses...)

AFC Eddie We took some instruments from a couple of SSsongs we really liked....Then loaded 'em into Audiozap fortweaking and size control, which is really essential forSynthCreate. Then, used Synthcreate to make a couple of newwave files. We tried out a bunch of MIDI sequencesconverted with Midimate...and Voila!

AFL Marty I'd like to know what Jim means when he says theinstruments are "tuned" to the FUN instruments.

DYA Jim1 They're not tuned to the FUN instruments, they'retuned to each other and to the keyboards they were sampledfrom.

AFL Marty My mistake. What does that mean though?

DYA Jim1 So, a G#4 played by SoundSmith should sound thesame (excluding the degradation of quality) as a G#4 in the

same instrument on the synthesizer it was digitized off of.

Mr Toaster Hmmm, good idea.

AFL Marty Okay... that makes it clear. Thanks.

AFA Gene Yep, Jim, I had to do the same thing when Idigitized my own custom SS insts. (compensating for tuning imean)

DYA Jim1 Yeah, that was a pain :)

AFL Marty How hard was it to accomplish (the tuning)?

DYA Jim1 You'll really have to ask Matt.. BUT, he did aLOT of work in experimenting using a lot of trial and errorI believe in finding the proper settings to digitize andplayback at. It wasn't easy. The tuning problem is whatpushed back the release of the disk about 4-6 months.

Mr Toaster Sounds like a real pain to me.

AFA Gene I did it by ear, so I guess it's just a pain inthe butt. To me it was like tuning a piano.

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AFL Marty I figured it wasn't easy.

DYA Jim1 Matt has a great ear for this kinda stuff though:) He's done a bunch of soundSmith songs off of songs ontapes of his, with no sheet music and such :)

AFC Eddie Jim, I'd like to get together with you for some

hints, as I'd like to create some insts with the sounds frommy Proteus.

DYA Jim1 Ahh, a Proteus. (I just got a "Proteus/XRImpressions" soundcard for my D70 :)

AFL Marty I know that disk represents a lot of work.Hopefully folks will appreciate that (and maybe send money:)

DYA Jim1 Perhaps you, I, and Matt could meet togethersometime and talk about it. I hope so Marty :)

AFC Eddie Soon you may hear SLab songs with the DYA insts!

AFL Marty You know, when you release something like aninstrument disk there's always the danger that folks willthink you did it in an afternoon.

DYA Jim1 good point.

AFL Marty Now that it's in the transcript they'll knowbetter. :)

DYA Jim1 Maybe we should add something like "Four monthsin the making" or however long it took (I forget :)

AFL Marty I really do appreciate all the work it took. (Myfavorite sound, by the way, is Milk Bubbles :) That's theperfect name for that sound.

AFA Gene Yeah, reminds me of when ultima 5 came out..."six man-years in the making" :)

AFL Marty Has anyone created any tunes with the newinstrument disk?

DYA Jim1 The DYA Sampler song in the library demonstratessome of the sounds from a very beta (not tuned very well)

version of the disk. But that's about all I know of so far.

AFL Marty Maybe a contest would generate interest (justthinking out loud)

AFC Eddie Good idea!

AFL Marty I'll work on some details and EMail them to you.

AFC SteveB (I have a music question for after the chat :)

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AFL Marty No Steve... I will NOT sing "Feelings".

AFC Eddie Shoot, Steve!

AFC SteveB Ok! Are there any freeware/shareware Music Studioplayers? Or any util. that will let you listen to MS songs?

AFC Eddie I think there is one, Steve.

AFC Eddie Not sure if it's in our library or not, but I cancheck... So, you're all gonna check out my new SoundsmithSLab tunes, right?

AFL Marty Coitenly

Mr Toaster I just saw the Amiga MOD converter in yourlibrary. One o' my roomies has an Amiga w/ lots o' mods.I'll get some when he comes back to Houston in the fall

AFC Eddie Steve, I know I have one somewhere. I'll lookfor it for you!

AFC SteveB Thanks Eddie! :)

AFL JoyceM Great news for me...just got accepted to sell mypaintings in a top gallery here in Denver :)

AFL Marty Congratulations!

AFC Eddie Fantastic, Joyce!!!!!!!!

AFL JoyceM And they will appear in a 1992 Calendar :)...amso excited :)

AFC SteveB ()()()() Joyce!

AFC Eddie WOW, now you can trade in that D-5 for a Korg T1!

AFL JoyceM Don't I wish...got to learn the D-5 first :)

DYA Jim1 LOL :) T1's rule :)

AFA Gene Congrats Joyce! :)

DYA Jim1 too bad they're so damn expensive :)

DYA Jim1 Congrats

AFL JoyceM Thanks guys....

AFL Marty How expensive?

Mr Toaster WOW Joyce!!! What great news!!!!

DYA Jim1 the lowest model - T3 - I've seen for about $2700for the keyboard

AFC Eddie List $5669 Marty.

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AFL Marty ::faint::

DYA Jim1 (ahh, thanks Eddie :)

AFL JoyceM Good grief....picking self off the floor!!

DYA Jim1 it sounds great though :)

AFL Marty It better!

AFL JoyceM You can buy a car for that...almost!

AFC Eddie But, that's just list.

Mr Toaster Everything but the power door locks! LOL!

AFA Gene Marty keeps having major medical problems at AMSchats. :)

AFL JoyceM Fainting seems to be one of those medical

problems.

AFC Eddie It's still rather humid here in CT where Martyand I live. So, fainting can happen!

DYA Jim1

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AFL JoyceM Jim...want to thank you and DYA for comingtonight...most enlightening and we look forward to HotLicks...

AFC Eddie And thanks for the great instrument disk!!!

AFL JoyceM Oh, and that too...great!

DYA Jim1 Thanks for the invitation Joyce :) Thankseveryone! :)

AFL Marty Hot Licks is awesome!

AFL JoyceM Thank you!

AFL JoyceM ---------------log off------------